Suggestion on Bag of Holding + Equipment

[jon50559]

The Bag of Holding is a very powerful item, but its strength isn't immediately obvious. Where its specialty lies is in allowing you to bring every tool available into battle. This is important because the game is a matter of bringing a diverse selection of weapons and armor with you, in able to defeat the varied elemental and physical enemies contained in one map. When you can bring every weapon and armor worth carrying with you at once free of weight, barring the item limit, a problem starts to present itself: if you have immediate access to armors and weapons to render you very effective against every element, it's essentially the same as having one single armor/weapon give you effectiveness against everything.

In other words, you're every bit as strong as the toolset you bring with you (meaning everything powerful in the game).

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• IDEA

So, I propose a change to how the Bag of Holding works. An item limit should be put into the BoH, we'll call this amount X for now. A while ago a gameplay element called your WEIGHT used to be a huge factor in how you played. We've come a long way since then, and I am certainly not suggesting fully moving back to that time; however, we've all but abandoned that element of gameplay and I'd say almost no players are affected by their weight at all anymore.

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• HOW THIS AFFECTS YOU

Ideally you won't be able to carry as much, and this could potentially increase gameplay risk/reward. A lot of players know this feeling all too well: A new map is released, yay! More stuff to do! They votemap to it and proceed to pound through it with little resistance. After not too long, the map is trivial to beat and all that precious lewt is spread around the community.

An element of strategy has to be taken into account before going to a map now, you have to think ahead and plan your equipment more carefully in order to handle everything in the map. This would positively affect new map releases as well, since you generally do not know what might surprise you, and you may have to go back to helena to re-plan your equipment selection.

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• I DON'T LIKE THIS

Don't fear! I'm not proposing a radical rebalance of the game, but a simple change such as introducing X item limit into the BoH would very much benefit the game. There would even be an opportunity for more high level quests! You need more storage in that BoH? Complete these quests dear sir and cherish the reward of +X number of slots to your BoH! Having it upgradable is almost essential to this suggestion; in addition to making your enjoyment of the rest of the game higher, it also gives you more things to do! YAY!

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In response to criticism: I understand your complaints and don't care if you don't agree with me. However, this thread's goal isn't only to suggest a change to the BoH, but it should encourage more suggestions of rebalances! Keep in mind I'm NOT talking about nerfs, but rebalances. This means that there's give and take, you change little things about a lot of items, just to keep the game more fresh. Some items have been unchanged for years, and that just makes the game stagnant.

 

[TheOysterHippopotami]

I agree with this completely. The BoH broke the game more seriously than any other item and if it hadn't been released, maps today would be more fun.

 

[MS:C community]

I disagree with this completely.

 

[Keldorn]

Taking another few minutes for every map run to go to helena first doesn't really add anything to the game.

...And that's ignoring the fact that chest scrolls exist.

...And that at 1000+ HP (Heck, maybe even 800+ HP), weight doesn't matter anyway.

 

[Stormshift]

I foresee chest scroll crashes increasing 25,000%.

 

[jon50559]

I don't think changing its storage capacity would be so dramatic that you would have to revisit a bank every map change, and it would give more use to chest scrolls.

And at that level of HP you really shouldn't be burdened by weight. But I'd say most people who have a BoH are not at that level.

 

[TheOysterHippopotami]

Weight should always be an issue, regardless of your level. But it should do more than it does now.

In an ideal world, our weight system would boost damage dealt by heavy weapons like claymores and big hammers/axes. It would also nerf evasion. So, players wearing heavy armors and wielding heavy weaponry would be playing a certain way and engaging certain enemies, while players carrying lighter weapons and wearing lighter armors would have different advantages and would have to behave accordingly.

 

[zeus9860]

If you concern is about noobs running around with the boh too early, then ask for a stat requirement in the item rather than nerf it and force people to use chest scrolls/towns more often, it's like keldorn said. I see no point in this tbh.

I kinda agree with oyster last post, it's would be nice to... y'know, land a punch and kill ihotohr in 1 hit while carrying 1 ton of junk with me. (suggestion, increased weight = decreased movement, increased damage; stuff like this) :roll:

 

[Regorty]

Noooo! I only had mine for a week and I have gotten to love it soo much! Its like my best friend that i can rely on to get me through tough maps and not not every 5 minutes and only die every 6 minutes, I do a lot decoy/playing with higher levels cause I don't wanna play alone, hahahaha!

But in a serious level, if any changes were to be made, is it possible to limit the number of weapons/armors able to be carried in it? Cause I love being able to hold all my potions and junk in the bag too!

 

[zeus9860]

But in a serious level, if any changes were to be made, is it possible to limit the number of weapons/armors able to be carried in it? Cause I love being able to hold all my potions and junk in the bag too!

Inb4 said action makes all the excessive items go poof, or corrupt characters. :roll:

 

[FreshMeat]

"it's essentially the same as having one single armor/weapon give you effectiveness against everything"

I'm sorry to say this, but you are completely wrong. And since your premise is flawed, so is your entire argument. The boh gives you ACCESS to all your items, but it does NOT give you the EFFECTS of all the items at the same time. Indeed, in my boh I have a helm of fire resist and a phoenix armor, but unless I wear those items, I do not receive their effects. Let me make this a bit more clear; you have said in your premise that because I can switch to all my armors and weapons as I please since I have them all in my boh, that if I am attacked by a fire minion, a poison minion, and a ice minion at the same time, that I am effectively immune to all of them. WRONG. Wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong!

 

[jon50559]

Perhaps what I wrote didn't convey my message completely, which is why I included this after the first paragraph:

In other words, you're every bit as strong as the toolset you bring with you

I think that clears things up.

Also, thanks for replying to only nitpick on a single sentence which wasn't worded perfectly.

 

[FreshMeat]

I'm not nit picking, and the sentence in question ("it's essentially the same as having one single armor/weapon give you effectiveness against everything") is the premise to your reasoning. The sentence ("In other words, you're every bit as strong as the toolset you bring with you") with which you say fixes the flaw in your premise is actually just a statement, which has nothing to do with your premise.

I don't know why I'm surprised by how you are reacting. I didn't call you stupid or anything, just that your reasoning is flawed.

 

[Thothie]

Personally, I'm not big on the concept of hampering players by merely inconveniencing them. Difficulties should involve some sort of progressive goal, rather than item re-arrangement.

Additionally, this would hamper the mid level players to the extreme, while having almost no affect on the high level players... Who could simply resort to backpacks, not being affected much by actual encumbrance.

...and yes, as Stormshift points out, it would likely also result in Galat Bank crashes left and right.

It's sorta like the inconvenience ideas that involve forcing a player to go back to Edana or such before each battle - and similar such - it just makes it more difficult to play, rather than more interesting.

It takes several moments to re-arrange equipment to deal with new element combinations - most players won't bother, save maybe once at the beginning of a map, if that - and even then, it's usually just one component of their apparel. Switching weapons to deal with different elemental resistances is more common, but that reaction is as it should be - and weapon weight is so much less than armor that it wouldn't be affected by this. Really, only the full plate armors would be affected - and everyone would likely resort to AOB just to avoid the inconvenience (not that several people don't already).

Frankly, if we had better level requirement controls for worn items, and didn't have to worry about overflows or entity overhead, I'd be quite happy axing the weight system entirely. It's really only designed to prevent low level characters from hauling around high level equipment, and it isn't very effective in that regard. Hopefully MSS won't adopt it.